'Dancing With the Stars' Casting Director Deena Katz on Keeping the Show Relevant 34 Seasons In

In September, Dancing With the Stars season 34 debuted on ABC with a cast composed of contestants from all walks of celebrity. Among the group were an actress best known for a nostalgia-inducing turn in The Parent Trap (Elaine Hendrix); two sometimes-feuding Mormon Wives of MomTok (Whitney Leavitt and Jen Affleck); a lovable comedian who became the season’s underdog (Andy Richter); a content creator with more than 7 million followers (Alix Earle); and two nepo faves (Steve Irwin’s son, Robert, and Zac Efron’s brother, Dylan). It was poised to be a season like many others—wholesome! family-friendly! very sparkly!—but as the weeks went by, ratings kept climbing. By October, it grew its viewership for five consecutive weeks, breaking a 1991 record, according to the network’s research. Appearing on linear TV in prime time, the series has also attracted a groundswell of viewers ages 18 to 49, despite the adage that the demo had long abandoned network TV.

Much of the renewed energy stems from the show's presence on TikTok, where couples post meme-y updates and engage in trends throughout the week, and clips of the show’s dances regularly go viral. But that wouldn’t happen without a cast that’s game, digitally savvy, and perfectly suited to break through the dizzying media landscape.

Deena Katz, the show’s longtime casting director and co-executive producer, has been refining the star power formula for 20 years—as long as the show’s been around—but still, she never would have predicted that this would be the year they broke records. “If you would've told me when ABC called me before they even picked up the show, that come season 34, we'd be the number one show on broadcast television, I wouldn't have believed it,” she says. “I wish I could tell you exactly why that is because I could make a whole lot of money selling this for other shows.”

Ahead, Katz, who also casts the U.S. version of The Traitors, breaks down how she finds the right fit for one of her shows, how she pairs stars with pro dancers, who she wishes would just say yes to DWTS, and what’s in store for season 4 of The Traitors, premiering in January.

Marie Claire: When you cast stars for the show, how are you thinking about their social media presence and online engagement when that wasn't part of the show's DNA at the very beginning?

Deena Katz: You look back at season 1 and we had an athlete, a boy-bander, an actor, a soap opera star. There were less categories. Celebrity itself has evolved over the years and it makes it more fun. You can tap into more audiences now because there's so many different categories of what a celebrity is.

TikTok has taken on a different world. So many members of [the younger] generation follow our TikTok that you almost feel like you have to watch the show to keep up with TikTok. If you don't watch the show, you don't understand what's going on all week. Then once people start watching the show, they're like, "Oh, my gosh, I really like it.” My 25-year-old daughter comes over to the house now and shows me old freestyles as if I don't know them.

MC: In the past few years, there've been way more Gen Z-coded stars who have these huge social media followings. How are you thinking about bringing in that younger star?

DK: It was harder because some people used to think that we're a little bit of an older show and the younger [contestants] are more like Disney kids. I really tried to keep the show relevant. I used to always put someone in who did something all of a sudden. Like Melissa Rycroft [who appeared on season 8 and won season 15’s All-Stars] was on because she was on The Bachelor. A couple seasons ago when we cast Charli D'Amelio [who won season 31], it turned. Suddenly, that generation was like, My gosh, look at Charli doing it. That season was a turning point. Things started to evolve from there.

This is the show that kids, parents, and grandparents can all watch together. I don't expect everybody to know all of the contestants. What I really want are those people that get you to watch it, but then you end up falling in love with the one that you didn't know beforehand. My daughter started watching this season because of Alix Earle, but now she and her friends love Andy Richter and Elaine Hendrix. To me, success is that my daughter is crying every week, hoping that Andy lasts. You can root for Alix Earle still, but you fall in love with something else.

MC: How do you pair the dancers with the stars?

DK: I’m so stressed by it. As soon as I cast someone, I'm already thinking who, in my gut, is their best pairing. Sometimes I do things that the audience is expecting. Sometimes I don’t. Some of it is height—really basic things. Or if a celebrity is flying back and forth, there are some dancers that are better to fly back and forth, who maybe don't have kids. Also, I would never want a dancer to always be with the football player because for the audience, our dancers are our stars and so you want to see them do something different and have a different story. I try to make every single pairing a pairing that I think could make it to the finals.

Some of the celebrities in the past have asked for certain dancers. Sometimes I've done it, sometimes I haven't, and sometimes I've had real conversations with them. "I hear you. You just need to trust me." And there've been a couple people in particular that were pretty adamant and then won the show with somebody else.

MC: Swifties were so excited to see Eras Tour dancer Jan this season, paired with Jen Affleck. Did you intend to pick someone from the Eras tour specifically?

DK: Taylor Swift’s dad started putting it out over a year ago, talking about how great Jan would be. I think he talked to Rob Mills [the VP of alternative series at ABC Studios] about it. I ended up going to the last Taylor Swift concert in Vancouver with my daughter and some friends. I sat down and had coffee with Jan. He's charming, he's everything. For him, it's taking a chance. This is a whole world that he's not used to. This guy can dance, can teach, can choreograph—social media is what he had to learn the most on this show. He was never promoting himself before.

MC: Is there anybody who is your white whale for casting right now?

DK: I have silly ones that you wouldn't even understand. I've asked more people than you'll ever imagine from prime ministers on down. The most they can do is say no to me. Some people like Danielle Fishel, who is on this season, I asked so many times and it wasn't right for her. There is something about timing. Same with Kirstie Alley [who appeared on season 12 and season 15]. She kept saying no. I'm like, “I will keep asking you.”

MC: Scheana Shay from Vanderpump Rules is an example of someone who has spoken publicly about wanting to be on the show. When someone is so obvious about wanting it, does that impact your casting?

DK: From season 2, Alfonso Ribeiro [the current host who won season 19] started asking me. But it just wasn't the right season. There've been seasons in the past where I will ask somebody to be on the show who I really have to convince. But, the people who do best are the people that really want to be here. If this is your dream and if you want to be here, the audience can see it.

That being said, maybe 10 percent of the people who have been on the show have been people that reached out to me that I didn't go to first. I remember Stacy Keibler back in season 2 came to me.

MC: So you're saying Scheana should keep saying she wants it?

DK: I actually met her like a year ago at some reality TV awards show. I literally said to her, “You just need to know I’m Deena Katz.” So, yes. Keep trying.

MC: Are there any casting choices you regret?

DK: Not really. I think there are some people that I thought would've done better than they did. But I don't ever audition anybody. I don't know how well you dance, and I don't know how well you're going to pick it up or how fast you're going to pick it up or what the audience is going to think. I'm trying to stay away from political [people] right now.

MC: There are no dance auditions?

DK: There have never been. As crazy as it sounds, we're not a real dance competition. This is a journey about people. Mostly, the best dancer doesn't usually win. It's that whole package. So it doesn't matter how much experience or what you can do because it's really everybody just learning this and within learning these dances, coming on this fantastic journey.

MC: You cast The Traitors, too, and it's been fun to see the pipeline between the shows, like Dylan Efron and Chrishell Stause appearing on both. When you're casting these shows, are you doing them in silos or are you thinking, This person would be good on both?

DK: There are some people who are better for one show than another. Chrishell was on this show way before she was on Traitors, but once I started doing Traitors, it's like she is fantastic and she'd be great. I found Dylan and he ended up popping on Traitors. That was part of listening to the audience. Once he was on, I was like, he must be on Dancing. I talked to Dylan way back in March, and had lunch with him and Rob Mills. He had never even thought about doing this. [DWTS pro] Mark Ballas, who’s appearing on the next season of Traitors, and his wife would literally text me every single week as they watched it and I was like, "Wait buddy, you actually are a real fan." It was like, “Absolutely, on your off-season, go on over there.”

MC: I'm excited to watch Donna Kelce. How do you cast someone like that who's untested on reality TV?

DK: It’s a lot of research. But on Traitors, if you can't play the game, you just get lost. When I came on to cast season 2, it was really more of The Challenge and the Big Brother and the Survivor people who know how to play a game.

As the show became such a hit, more people started watching the show and wanted to do it. I found out that Donna was a fan of the show. We didn't tell anybody, but she had watched the Australia and U.K. versions, too. When we first put her on, I don't think anybody knew what a fan she was, but she was in it to play the game. Season 4 going into season 5 and such, you can get people that you didn't know were fans and you didn't know could play the game and wanted to play the game.

MC: Are there any reality shows that have casting that you're jealous of or you've been inspired by?

DK: There's always somebody on some show that’s like, How’d they do that? I love Marshawn Lynch and when he went on Stars on Mars, I'm like, “How’d they get Marshawn to go to Mars?

MC: Is there one casting decision over the past few years that you're really proud of?

DK: A few years ago, when I put Amy Purdy on the show, people probably didn't know her that well. She literally had two prosthetics below the knee. I love when you can have somebody come on the show and have one person realize they can get off the couch and they can do this too. I'm way more proud of the inspiration part than if I got some movie star to do this show.

This interview was edited and condensed for clarity.